vaccinations and other stuff

Summary:

I have come to the decision that this site does not transgress from ANY official line by and large with its commentary.

vaccinations and other stuff

Twinklestar (guest) 27 Oct 2010 04:39

I mean by this that MOST of the commentators support whatever the Govt/corporate line is. If i say vaccinations are harmful I would be attacked or if i say fluoridation is harmful I would be shouted down because these are official Govt. positions and on it goes throughout the threads. Whether it be that Jung said there is a spirit I would be told that it is not true or whatever. It seems to be across the board. If i say SOME crop circles can not be explained away as a hoax I would be abused even if i showed evidence for this.

Please tell me that is not the case and this is not another disinformation site I am spending my time on.

Re: vaccinations and other stuff

Astrogeek 27 Oct 2010 05:19

You obviously haven't been reading very carefully. There are several posters in these forums who are seriously anti-government on a couple of issues.

You wish to stake out a position that goes against the evidence, and then you wish to claim that we are merely toeing the "government/corporate line" when we take you on?

Here's a switch: How about you play by "the rules". Not "my rules" but the rules of logic. If you make a claim (i.e., "vaccinations are harmful") then I expect you to state exactly what you mean, and support your statement with facts and evidence.

If you can't do that, then you have not supported your position, and you have failed in the argument.

As an example, if you claim that vaccines cause autism, then I would expect you to show data (not a bunch of news reports, or claims by ex-playmates turned into public crusaders) that supports your position. I would also expect that you would be able to address data that shows the opposite of your position. In other words, you have to defend your claim against the available evidence.

Here's the thing: Making a claim is easy. Supporting that claim is hard. Defending the claim is even harder. But that's the way science works.

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"Do you ever think about things you do think about?" - Henry Drummond to Matthew Harrison Brady in Inherit the Wind

Re: vaccinations and other stuff

Marko S 27 Oct 2010 17:32

Making a claim is easy. Supporting that claim is hard. Defending the claim is even harder. But that's the way science works.

Ok, this one goes to my unofficial citation collection!

Well put, sir!

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One's convictions should be proportional to one's evidence. - Sam Harris

Re: vaccinations and other stuff

Astrogeek 28 Oct 2010 05:46

bows

Thank you, thankyouverymuch.

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"Do you ever think about things you do think about?" - Henry Drummond to Matthew Harrison Brady in Inherit the Wind

Re: vaccinations and other stuff

TheGreatJuju 27 Oct 2010 07:12

I mean by this that MOST of the commentators support whatever the Govt/corporate line is.

What Astrogeek said ("…several posters in these forums who are seriously anti-government…"), and I am one of them. I am astounded by the likes of you and Dharma/Joshua and others over the six months I've been here, who have repeatedly made claims of this nature with absolutely no regard for reality.

If i say vaccinations are harmful…

Whether it be that Jung said there is a spirit…

If i say SOME crop circles can not be explained away…

You're really running the gamut there. Did it ever occur to you that the evidence for these claims is simply MIA? Is that what you mean by "shouted down?" Noting this lack of evidence, and people getting their feelings hurt when bald assertions aren't enough? If not, what do you mean? Can you provide one example of a conspiracy theorist on this board making a solid, scientifically- and logically-valid case for a position, only to be "abused" for it?

Please tell me that is not the case and this is not another disinformation site I am spending my time on.

I think the disinformation sites are more likely to be the ones from which you're getting your news on vaccines and crop circles. That's why we ask for evidence, and why you should make some effort to differentiate assertions and claims per se from reliable evidence in support of them.

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"They tell you, but do you believe it? If so, why?"

http://www.undeadrufus.com

Moo (guest) 27 Oct 2010 05:53

I think the funny part here is Twinklestar is supporting EVERY single Right-Winged theory, not simply conspiracy, in the book so far. I mean, I'm struggling to see where the line between "ZOMG!" and "Okay that's just stupid" is with this one.

I was actually about to state the logic behind Twinklestar's post… but then I saw that Astrogeek wants them to do it for themselves. I agree. I almost gave her/him an auto-out. Whoops.