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I thought we were making a page on this guy, but I can't find anything. From the amazon reviews for his book, people really believe what he says in it. 34 five stars out of like 44 total reviews. I think someone needs to take up Kyle's offer and debunk the guy. I haven't been able to find anything on the web making the attempt. 2012hoax can be the first! (and perhaps get kyle to shut down his website?)
I understand that you're excited and honestly, I am excited too. This could change people's opinion about his book. But first of all, someone need to buy his book, that may be pretty expensive… or not.
I have some research gathered, but nothing online yet.
Unfortunately I'm unable to find Mr. Horn's book at any library available to me, so in order to review it I would have to purchase one. I don't want to purchase one.
"Do you ever think about things you do think about?" - Henry Drummond to Matthew Harrison Brady in Inherit the Wind
What is the name of the book? Perhaps I find something in Google Books.
Edit: I found this in Google Books.
http://www.amazon.com/Apollyon-Rising-2012-Mystery-Revealed/dp/0982323565/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1295488610&sr=1-1
http://www.amazon.com/Nephilim-Stargates-Year-Return-Watchers/dp/0978845315/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1295488610&sr=1-2
"Do you ever think about things you do think about?" - Henry Drummond to Matthew Harrison Brady in Inherit the Wind
I just found this on Kyle's website —> http://worldwidewakeupnow.com/2011/01/and-it-continues/
He clearly has some issues. Although, I would love to see him take down his site. If his claim is that freemason's are obsessed with the number 11 and apparently do something bad every 11 years, than I would be pleased to hear what happened in 1990, or 1979, or 1968.
Oh and the “Whatever, not 2012 related.” unfortunately my friend you are wrong again. This person obviously knows nothing about the Freemasons and the grip they’ve had on America since day one, if he did he wouldn’t have said “I challenge the freemasons to mess with citizens of some parts of the America.” Dude, the freemasons HAVE been ‘messing’ with citizens of America since day one and you don’t even know it, atleast 14 Presidents (including the very first George Washington) were Freemasons and the list of politicians today that are Freemasons is disturbing
I still don't know what this has to do with 2012.
Anyone's thoughts?
I dont know enough about his black box claim to add anything.
Well, I don't know how secretive the American group of Freemasons is, but the Swedish branch is far from what Dan Brown and others describe. To be honest, Freemasons tend to be quite boring and not all that keen on ritual murders and what not. As for the obsession with number 11, that can at least be somewhat true. Although not the bad part, as far as I know. One thing that I can't understand is how these people constantly claim that Freemasons more or less rule the world, but on the other hand "dares" to oppose them on the net. Are they trying to act like martyrs or what?
I mean, if Freemasons really are all that powerfull, then why don't they just "silence" people like Kyle? Just seems strange that they have so much power and still can't keep guys like Kyle from spreading the word.
And James, I can gladly admit that the connection to 2012 is vague at best. The link is mostly talk about NWO, and Illuminati and the Freemasons role in this (two former enemies, never the less)
Facts are stubborn things.
- Ronald Reagan
Well, it isn't actually 2012 related, but a number of conspiracy theorists have been trying to demonize the Masons and associate them the the nonexistent Illuminati and NWO. The Masons are no more sinister than the Elks Lodge or the Lions Club. I don't see how the fact that some of our founding fathers (he forgot to include Benjamin Franklin in his rant) and presidents have been Masons makes the organization evil or sinister.
The Shriners, who have the Shriners Burn Hospital for Children, are Masons. I would consider that a benevolent organization. My grandfather was a Mason, my mother a member of the Eastern Star (the women's auxiliary), and I was a member of Job's Daughters (the girl's auxiliary). Funny how we never noticed what an evil organization it was (sarcasm).
Yeah and not to mention it was completely dumb to try and tell me that he didn't mention the Maya. Do people forget where these claims stem from? Whether or not you want to drag your government conspiracies into it, it still is a phenomena that stems from the long count calendar of the ancient Maya. If you can't tie in your conspiracies with that, well, you're in trouble already.
"If his claim is that freemason's are obsessed with the number 11 and apparently do something bad every 11 years, than I would be pleased to hear what happened in 1990, or 1979, or 1968."
Cannot give you anything for 1979 or 1968 because as far as I know nothing happened on those dates…I can however for the year 1990 point you to a speech that then President (and Freemason) George H. W. Bush gave us a speech on September the 11th, 1990 saying that we have the opportunity for a 'New World Order'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rc7i0wCFf8g&feature=player_embedded
I can try to embed the video here but highly doubt it will work, so if not just click on the above link:
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I have no doubt you're all going to shrug that off and say it's a coincidence and means nothing, and if you really want to believe the sickening timing on that (September 11th 1990, we all know what happened eleven years to that date when the presidents son and also fellow Freemason was in charge of this country) as nothing to worry about, by all means be my guest and laugh it off. For the rest of us and those who believe in the times we live in, and can read between the lines to see what's really going on, are dying to see (poor choice of words considering potential consequences…) what happens September 11th 2012, 11 years after the horrific attacks on the world trade center in 2001.
2012 being 11 years after 2001 is what 'this has to do with 2012.'
And so far as the black box claim goes, google or wikipedia it and you will see that for the first time in recorded history on Sept 11th, 4 of those indestructible black boxes were never recovered. I understand this is the first time attacks like this have happened, but also understand that they've been recovered in every other instance including extreme temperature from crashes or even falling to the bottom of the ocean if the airline crashed over water. I saw already that some of you said 'it doesn't raise a red flag and shouldn't to anyone else' but that's very alarming to me especially since you guys call yourselves critical thinkers. The odds edgewise of it not being a conspiracy and for the first time all 4 really were never recover literally translate to one in millions, possibly one in billions.
I don't see how anyone can shrug all of this off, George H. W Bush's speech in 1990 the attacks of Sept 11th 2001 AND the black boxes never being found, along with 2012 being the year that falls 11 after 2001, as a coincidence and say nothing foul is up. I understand NWO is the mother of all conspiracy's out there and difficult to even fathom as possible, but consider I myself was once like you guys laughing at the 'tin foil hat nuts' that thought that until I took a step back and looked at everything that was going on. Hopefully I am wrong and it's all a giant coincidence, but the numbers definitely don't add up to suggest that
Say the word and Kyle will forward you a copy of his book
Say the word and Kyle will forward you a copy of his book
Unfortunately, that would require giving one's forwarding address to a person who believes in magical forces, has an established track record of drama and dishonesty, and refers to himself in the third-person.
Wow you guys are way too smart for me it looks like, good call 'great ju ju' there's no such thing as Ebooks or electronic copies of Tom Horn's book… so 'unfortunately' I WOULDN'T need anyone's physical address I would just need someone's email address.
I really love how you guys think you're the smart ones who know what's going on, and try oh so hard to make me feel like an ass or dumb. You're all rather smug, arrogant people here you wonder why I lob back at you guys so sarcastic and viciously in some of my posts. God help us all, seriously..I'm forwarding a copy of the book to Bill Hudson right now, anyone who wants a copy to 'debunk' it just talk to him
I'm forwarding a copy of the book to Bill Hudson right now, anyone who wants a copy to 'debunk' it just talk to him
He will "love" this stupid book… don't be such an idiot. Anyway, he will just read the synopsis of the book and throw it off, but you made a lovely action, and 'unfortunately', we have to thank you for giving us a chance to debunk another proponent.
LMFAO him just 'reading the synopsis' and throwing it out will NOT constitute in me shutting down my websites, careful who you're calling 'idiot' there buddy your ignorance is showing by saying you're going to 'debunk' a whole entire book just by reading the synopsis. I pray you wake the hell up and understand what's going on in the real world, otherwise you're going to be blindsided by what's coming just like you probably were for 09/11 and the recent economic downturn, and the second half of that down turn coming anytime now despite our President saying the nation is in a 'state of recovery' please…I don't know how anybody can buy any of the bullshit that comes out of politicians mouths these days
just by reading the synopsis
Nobody deserves read all this bunch of stupid claims. And I think that if Astrogeek or anyone else create a page debunking his claims, the Synopsis it's enough for this.
But I will wait for the decision of Bill, and how his page will be.
Dude. Debunking isn't just reading a synopsis. Please, show some respect to how we do things. =/
And goodluck 'debunking' that book there wiseguy, if it's such an easy task perhaps you should take on the challenge of reading the whole thing and 'debunking' it so that you can take down both of my websites. Trust me though, that 'stupid book' doesn't give you a snowballs chance in hell of debunking it…maybe that's why if you try to google or look up a 'debunking' of that book you'll find that no one out there has done it yet because it CANT be done. Don't tell me that's just a 'coincidence' too, when every other book under the sun has some critic trying to say how its all wrong
The reason I couldn't find any debunking, is simply because the guy just isn't popular and he gets lost in the thousands of government conspiracy books already on the shelves. People love conspiracy, they don't like it when they feel that things aren't all in order and aren't all "planned out" so they make conspiracies with no evidence of such. Thomas Horn knows this, and wrote a book exploiting the 2012 hoax for money. Whether you want to believe that or not, its your choice, but remember that you are ranting your beliefs without actually testing the evidence.
So George Bush made this speach in 1990 that mentioned a New World Order. Well gosh, how obvious can you get?!?111 Of course thats related to the terrorist act in 2001, I mean cmon, he made a speech! Its so comparable! Big planes flying into the trade center………..and a speech.
Sorry man, thats not gonna convince me of anything. I don't care whether you think the 9/11 attacks were a big conspiracy or not, but your linking it to a big event every 11 years is very fringe.
I doubt Tomy was effected much by the attacks in 2001. I believe he lives in Brazil. While the world economy isn't the best, its also not the worst by far.
I amuse myself by thinking what would Kyle be doing if he lived during one of the two World Wars. *shudder*
Just sayin' man, you may have the right intentions but the turn out could be very bad. This is how self fulfilling prophecies come true. If the president were to be assassinated on Sept 11, 2012 you would crow victory, but for all you know, the assassin could have been a regular visitor to your website. There you go, you indirectly fulfilled your own prophecy.
You can spend a lot of time here trying to convince us that you're correct and trying to help, but in the end, you're hurting and we're helping. Plus, I dont think you are predicting a global disaster, which makes our motives to debunk government conspiracy claims a little lower on our priority list.
I doubt Tomy was effected much by the attacks in 2001.
You're right. But recently the Wikipedia, with its superbrilliant article about 11 Septmeber attacks, provided good information about conspiracies theories surrounding this event and all to discuss with Kyle and all I need to know that there is no conspiracy.
Why is 9/11 getting pulled into a conversation about 2012? This guy is just a conspiracy theorist. After 2012 he's going to look for the next big scandal and he's going to come and tell us all what's "really" going down. Wish these people would find a more realistic way of feeling powerful and quit with the whole "a big boy done it and ran away" crap.
Why is 9/11 getting pulled into a conversation about 2012?
Sigh
Ask Kyle. He is the "genious" here (laugh). His opinion is that "we should not trust the Government" so if the government say: "nothing will happen in 2012", they are lying. This is what he claims.
Totally nonsense. 2012-11=2001… this is another Kyle's claim.
Dear Kyle, Greg and Additional Alter Egos:
good call 'great ju ju' there's no such thing as Ebooks or electronic copies of Tom Horn's book…
Well, you didn't specify "e-book" there, smart guy. If you have yet to hit puberty, as I suspect, you might be too young to know that the term "forward," at one time, didn't apply only to electronic mail.
Also, being the enterprising little woo artist, you might be aware that most legal copies of e-books contain one form or another of DRM, so it's usually not as simple as just clicking Attach and Send. If you have an unsecured e-book and the author is so desperate to spread his message that he doesn't care about piracy, then by all means, knock yourself out.
I really love how you guys think you're the smart ones who know what's going on, and try oh so hard to make me feel like an ass or dumb.
It requires no effort on the part of any 2012Hoax member to make you look like either of the above. As for you feeling that way or not, the religious devotion you have to your misguided ideas was noted long ago. You've buried your head in the sand of conspiracies and magic. We know.
You're all rather smug, arrogant people here you wonder why I lob back at you guys so sarcastic and viciously in some of my posts.
More like most of your posts, and it bears mentioning that you were doing this manner of nastiness even while Bill was still trying to be nice to you. FYI: demanding that you provide evidence to support your claims is neither "smug" nor "arrogant."
Don't be silly, Kyle.
This Third-Person-Kyle will not convince us.
Hey Kyle, you never did get back to me. If you believe in Thomas Horn's opinions on 2012 and politics, that means you do believe in /all/ of his other claims, right? Including the supernatural and magical ones that have absolutely no bearing what-so-ever?
Remember, Kyle. You /cannot/ cherry pick your reading material from an author. You either take all their work at face value, or you take /none at all/.
So, what is it? Do you believe in /all/ supernatural connections to the United States (and only the United States), the 2012 'conspiracy', and so on and so forth? Please, 'enlighten me'. Because if you dodge my question again, then I know for a /fact/ you're a fool.
Also, Tomy, James, and JuJu? Those remarks were a little uncalled for, guys. While I think this entire challenge is retarded, and Kyle's probably /not/ going to change anything, even if Horn's book is torn apart? It's still worth being respectful to the guy for even going this far. Most woo-artists don't.
I do have one more question for you, Kyle, and please don't dodge this one too. I'll word this in a neutral way, too.
"If 2012 comes and goes, and nothing happens, what will you do, when it comes down to all the people you've 'lied' to?"
It's still worth being respectful to the guy for even going this far.
Moo, have you followed this Kyle/Greg/Whoever-else saga? If not, I suggest you back up and catch up. The person in question, in all of his various incarnations, is a drama queen. Any respect he did or could have earned, he threw out the window.
Most woo-artists don't.
In fact, most woo artists do shovel loads of information at us — go to this website, read this book, watch this twenty-part series on YouTube — while consistently having no capacity whatsoever to defend their own claims.
I'm trying to be nicer, JuJu. I've been yelled at for being over-aggressive. That's all.
But I suppose you're right. I guess you all have him covered.
I'm trying to be nicer, JuJu. I've been yelled at for being over-aggressive. That's all.
Well, I take your point on that. If I had ripped into him after one post, or had done nothing but insult him all this time, I agree that would be uncalled for and counterproductive. However, this particular individual has established a pretty clear history. He's vaulted himself into the same category of repute occupied by Ivan Gorelik, in my opinion.
Hi moo,
I don't want you to think we are all coming down on you. You're a valued contributor here. There have just been a few, shall we say, overly enthusiastic comments that needed to be toned down.
I know. And I do enjoy being around! It's a great cause, one I wholly support.
Off-topic of this thread, but…
http://www.bandaicg.com/naruto/showthread.php?t=86386
Someone posting 2012 nonsense on a card game forum. You know, one both Teenagers and Children play, and likely some adults (Guilty!) While you can likely figure out who I am if you go through the thread, it's funny how many people aren't taking it seriously.
Still, what kind of scumbag brings up such nonsense in places like /that/?
I guess the same kind of scumbags that started the hoax and those who are exploiting it to make money, to say nothing of the ones who come here to rant at us and promote their own agendas. It infuriates me that there are so many jerks who just don't care what they are doing to young people as long as they can build their own egos and make money.
